by Piero Cammerinesi

I had the pleasure of meeting Shiva Ayyaddurai, American scientist and politician, in Rome on May 15, and it was really interesting to ask him some questions, not always politically correct, since he is a truly out-of-the-ordinary candidate for the U.S. presidency, with his positions regarding vaccines, artificial intelligence, medicine, mass manipulation etc.

As I was thinking about a title for this long interview with Dr. Shiva – as he calls himself – I was reminded of the title of a famous novel, from which a very famous movie, The Manchurian Candidate, was made.

In the case of the movie, it was about a politician being used as a puppet by occult, power forces, by ruthless lobbies capable of mentally manipulating him by turning him into an unwitting tool.

In the case of Shiva Ayyaddurai, who is Indian by birth, we are definitely faced with the opposite situation; instead, our Indian Candidate is the one who unmasks conspiracies and deceptions of power.

It must be said that he also considers a violation of the constitution to be legally fought against that a “Naturalized American Citizen” is considered second-class compared to a “Native Citizen” in terms of the possibility of being elected president.

In the interview he fires back at everyone, without regard.

From Antony Fauci to Elon Musk, from Robert F.Kennedy Jr. to Donald Trump, from Tucker Carlson to Bernie Sanders, to sacred monsters like Gandhi or Martin Luther King, in a crescendo of unmasking that is meant to stimulate people to become aware of the fact that power is mendacious by default – with whatever color it comes in – and that only movements that start from the bottom can succeed in truly changing things.

Happy reading.

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PIERO: Thank you for the kind opportunity, Dr. Shiva, to meet with you here in Rome. First of all, what brought you to Italy and above all, why have you started your tour in Sardinia?

SHIVA: It’s a good question. I have been to mainland Italy, here, probably about seven times, but I have always wanted to go to Sardinia and for a number of reasons.

First of all, just for the beauty of this island alone I wanted to visit it. Yet, another reason, Sardinia, I think, is in a geographically unique position. I mean it is in a very strategic position, if you think about it, that has served U.S and NATO imperialism, unfortunately, for too long. But it’s also a place, from a medicine standpoint that has a history of longevity.

My background, interestingly enough, always has intersected politics and medicine. So, to me, Sardinia, has intersected both of those aspects which include the fight for truth and freedom and the desire to really understand health.

You may know that I grew up in India with the caste system. Growing up in a traditional, indigenous system I was always fascinated as a kid wondering why these inequalities existed. And, I also grew up in my grandmother’s world–she was the local, village shaman. She was the one who people called on to heal them. I grew up fascinated by medicine, therefore, you see, the intersection has always been health and medicine, and truth and freedom, which is trying to understand why there’s systems of oppression.

In some and many ways, Sardinia – which I didn’t know to the extent – is also the intersection of both. I came here as a biologist, a systems biologist, interested to really understand something I have studied most of my life to understand how to be healthy. In Sardinia, scholars have written about these so-called Blue Zones where Sardinia has the longest and highest number per capita of people who live over 100 years. It’s a very interestingly isolated culture in some ways, with a very rich history that has unfortunately also been hidden. So, those are the things that made me really want to come to Sardinia. And, I have learned a lot on this trip, in particular, how the US and NATO imperialism has been taking advantage of the island and the people. And also the rich history of the people wanting to resist and fight back.

PIERO: Is this tour a European tour or just Italy and Sardinia?

SHIVA: Well, my intentions, you know–we have a movement. We have created a global movement for “Truth Freedom Health.” And we realized that I’ve always felt that I’ve been looking for a place in Europe to be sort of the meeting point—and Sardinia looks like it may be that location. We want to do more conferences here because it’s sort of an interesting area and a place where people would probably be inspired to come to. And it’s also sort of in the center of east and west in many ways.

PIERO: The second question: You have recently announced that you are running as an Independent in the 2024 presidential election. Why not run with the Republicans given that in both, 2017 and 2020, you ran for the Massachusetts Senate as a Republican candidate?

SHIVA: Well, first of all, in 2017-18 when I ran for US senate, I wanted to run as a Republican, but the Republican party and the Democrat Party are actually one Party. They’re a uni-party and you would have thought that the Republican party, which claims the ethos of meritocracy, that they’re into. As they define themselves as “people work,” “hard bottoms up” but it turns out that there is no such distinction. Especially in Massachusetts. If you think

about this is where the first shot was fired to start the American Revolution–Massachusetts–in many ways, when that Revolution took place, it’s not like the British got up and left after they lost.

In fact, they entrench themselves more in Massachusetts. If you think about it, you know Harvard’s there, etc. And so what’s happening is that left and the right in many ways they’re actually completely one in Massachusetts. But in Massachusetts they portray as though they’re different (and this is part of something we should discuss more as we get into this interview). But the reality is that when I ran you would have thought…

I never wanted to, by the way, ever run for electoral politics. I’ve always been a builder of movements since I was a 17 year old kid, bottoms up! …I do not believe that you can win from the top, down–even if you want to win these positions, for the kind of positions I take, politically, you have to have a movement.

So we decided to run because it was an interesting time. Donald Trump had announced he was going to run, and it seemed that, globally, as well as nationally, the working people were looking for anti-establishment forces; and I believe that Donald Trump or his advisors, or whomever you want to say controls him, were aware of this. That’s why they dropped him in and he spoke a lot of the anti-establishment rhetoric.

But the reality was he was not anti-establishment. If anything, he is fully part of the establishment. Therefore, when I ran, we ran against a woman called Elizabeth Warren, who was the sitting senator from Massachusetts. She got her position coming from at Harvard, where she is a professor, by claiming she was a Native American.

Now my run against her was not to expose the issue of race, which she took advantage of, but the issue of integrity. And so, 

PIERO: [Real Indian and not fake?] 

SHIVA: Yes, we made, I would say, it was one of the best ad campaigns in political history. We called it “Only the real Indian can defeat the fake Indian!” with a picture of me with her and people just loved it. The City of Cambridge tried to take down our banner saying we were violating some random law. I sued them in federal court and we won.

But the interesting thing is, the Republican establishment ran an idiot against her, because they had no intention of winning. You see, it’s all about Back Room deals that are made AND this is what people need to understand.

In fact, they ran a guy who photoshopped a picture with Trump, a fake handshake– to convince people that he was a “Trumper” and, because, you know, the Pro-Trump movement was there. So anyway, we ran as Independents. And to just correct you, in 2017, we ran as Independents.

In 2020, that is when I said, ”Okay, I’ll give the Republicans a shot.” and I ran as a Republican. And that’s when, you know, we discovered serious election fraud in the entire system. It was our campaign which exposed this, long before Trump. In fact, Trump used a lot of our stuff and raised about half a billion dollars. (I can talk to you later about that–

I had two meetings with him because he was all excited with the work I’d done.) But at the end of the day, we ran initially as an independent and then we ran as a Republican, and it was the Republicans who colluded with the Democrats to commit election fraud on me. So I don’t… both parties are two heads at the same serpent.

PIERO: Then Straight to the point– your chances of being elected are infinitesimal. Why then, the investment of money and commitment?

SHIVA: Looking at your question, first of all, let’s look at why you’re asking that question? I want to sort of dissect that. First of all, when a human being–any human being in the modern world–comes to a point where they decide what they want…they don’t accept the world the way it is…

PIERO: Status quo?

SHIVA: Yes! So you have two sets of human beings– Some people accept the way the world is. They are fine and say, “Well the world sucks and I can’t change it, so I’m going to maintain my own little garden here and you know I’m gonna live in quiet desperation.”

Or people go to the other extreme, where they may do terrorist activities…right?

But once people get beyond that point, they say, “Yes, I do want to change the world.” What are the two options that the establishments give them?

One is you can file lawsuits. You can get involved in the court system– something that has happened to you that’s not correct, so you are encouraged to find a lawyer and file lawsuits. That’s one vehicle.

The other: they say, “Well, why don’t you write to your congressman?” Right? You know, run for office! Electoral or Legalistic, right? So these are the two options that the typical, average person is given.

Now, in 1981, when I was a… that was 17 years old and I first came to MIT, I was very interested in politics since I was a four year old kid growing up in this caste system. And you may remember, at that time, Ronald Reagan was running for office as well as Walter Mondale – Republican and Democrat – and there was a third candidate running, called Jesse Jackson.

Now Jesse Jackson claimed he was building a movement–he called it the Rainbow Coalition and a number of activists like myself thought, “Maybe something will happen here.” So…but at the end of the day, on the evening of the Democratic national convention, Jesse Jackson basically said, “Well, you know, we have to choose the lesser of two evils.” and he gives all of his votes to Walter Mondale. And I haven’t confirmed this, yet– rumor was that he was offered a private jet for doing this. Ok?

So what I recognized as a kid was that the establishment is very clever. They have these two-wings, two shoulders, so the head of this is one. They have the Republican and Democrat “obvious” establishment–like today’s world, it’s like the Hillary Clintons, the Obamas, in the United States for the Democrats, and on the right, you have people like Mitch McConnell and you know those kinds of people. But the establishment has gotten much more clever over the last hundred years. They, also, don’t only have the shoulders, but they have the Wings. So on the left, they have people like AOC, Alexander Ocasio Cortez or Jesse Jackson or Bernie Sanders who bark at their own democratic establishment, but they do that just enough to manipulate people to think they’re fighting against the establishment. And like Jesse Jackson did at the last minute, they will always say, “Well, you got to, we have to choose a lesser of two evils.” You can see that Bernie Sanders did the same thing. You know that 2016 election. He said a lot of stuff against Hillary and at the last minute, he said, “Well, we have to support her. And I have many friends who said, “Oh, Bernie will never do that.” I said, ”Mark my words, he’s gonna do that.”

And then on the other wing, the right wing…the right wing had the tea party at one point in time… but they needed a new person to rile up the right and that’s the role of Donald Trump.

PIERO: So in short I would have understood, even though you have no chance to win, you have a moral duty to do this…?

SHIVA: Well, it’s deeper than that. So once you understand the dynamic, you recognize that every two to four years the establishment has gotten very clever and taking the broad mass of people and diverting them…that their citizenship is about voting on this one day and after that you go back to watching football or in the old days watching gladiators and Coliseum, right? So, they’ve created this very defined moment where they use that moment to make people think they have a Civic Duty. Now, I’m a big believer, not only a believer, but from a scientific and engineering standpoint, that when major change occurs there has always been bottoms up movements, period! So, in my view, it’s very strategic!Now, I’ll put it to you this way, for a guy like me who has all my degrees in MIT, who is clearly has a very clear positions of platforms and solutions, but I’m not part of the left and I ‘m independent, there is absolutely no way, that if I ever joined either party, I could even ever get my ideas out, because, you always have to compromise in that electoral process.

However, if someone like me ever wanted to win, the ONLY way to do it would be through building a movement; you have to have movement, ok?

So our goal and running at this important historical point is that I’ve created… now probably, three to four hundred billion people over the world know about Dr. Shiva… the “Truth Freedom Health” brand, you know, because they know and they saw what I did in 2020, as well as what I did in 2021. I was the first one to call out Fauci, so, I built a tremendous awareness and also people know they can trust me. I’ll always call out the bullshit long before others will because I’m not an opportunist. I actually want to see the world change. So, because of that, we have a unique opportunity–running for president gives us this very unique opportunity in history (given the following that I have) to expose the left and the right with uncompromising exposition. So if you notice, I was the first guy to expose Elon Musk recently, you know since December and I was the first one to expose Robert Kennedy, you know, this guy is a fake, okay?

The Kennedys, as a whole, are a fake, they are a mythology. I was the first one who exposed Fauci when it was not popular. I was the first one to expose the election systems fraud. I was the one who discovered, in my own lawsuit, that the government has a backdoor portal at Twitter. So I built a huge following of people saying “this guy will always tell us the truth.” So IF I even wanted to ever win the presidency with my values, there’s no way I could do it without building a movement.

So this running for president is going to do two things: first, it is going to educate lots of people about the fact that the left and right “screw you” every day–Democrats and Republicans. And the other thing is; we’re going to explosively grow our movement. So we win anyway. We already won with all the work I did in 2020. We already won with all the work I did in 2021 because we’ve raised human consciousness; and it is about raising consciousness, period!

PIERO: In very few lines, with your movement “Truth Freedom Health,” what is you election program regarding health care, economy, and war?

What we’ve done, our platform… We actually have six areas that we’re going after, but let me just answer your questions…It’s clear that our position on healthcare is very simple–if you look at the United States’s lifespan [showing a chart] starting in 1980 the rest of the world is going like this, and the United States is going down. Now, no one is talking about this but me. And if you look behind that curve…why’s the United States line going like that? It is not any one issue, it’s a systems issue…but if you go down to the simple biology of it, it is one simple answer–we have to enable people to strengthen their immune systems. So that’s me talking as a systems biologist, as an engineer, as someone who is an activist. So our entire healthcare program is simple: “Let’s boost people’s immune system.”

Now, we’re not going to WAIT for government to do that because the entire government process is completely corrupt. So what we’re doing is… when we go door to door, every once, every sixth Thursdays, we actually teach a course online, free! So we’re not going to say, ”we’re going to do this when we get elected,” we are actually going to teach people “What is the immune system?”… as I did in 2020. We teach people how you can protect your immune system and how you boost it. And as a part of that, we talk about the economics and the politics around that. Because ultimately, you have to give people something very tangible to do here and now.

So between now and 2024, just like in 2020, we saved millions of people’s lives with the protocols that I put out. We’re going to teach people that but in a much larger framework.So healthcare is–if you get down to it, the lifespan is going down in the United States (and none of these presidential candidates care about the human suffering of people,) and ultimately, we are the only ones who are going to give people a solution here and now. So that’s our “quote, unquote” platform. Our platform isn’t just a platform on health care; it’s actually delivering something here and now.

Next question you asked about is…?

PIERO: …Economy and war.

SHIVA: Let me talk about war first–U.S imperialism is based on expanding its markets; and, today, the elites in the world… it’s not that they’re even loyal to a country anymore…they’re everywhere. And so, my view… is on war–the United States should pull out of NATO, number one! It’s an old institution that should not even exist anymore (in my view) and many, many people agree with me on this. On war, I’ve always been an anti-war activist. You can go look back, in 2007, when I was getting my MIT PhD, I was the first one to say we should get out of Iraq. Since I was a kid, I’ve organized some of the largest protests against Iran, you know, the contra war, etc. So I’ve been an anti-war, ground activist most of my life. So that’s my position on war.

On the position, on the economy, fundamentally, what’s going on is during the pandemic 600 billionaires increased their wealth by 2.3 trillion dollars. Obama printed 8.1 trillion dollars.

Trump printed 6.2 trillion dollars. This is during the pandemic when Elon Musk made all of his money. So the printing of money… the United States is able to do this for one singular reason because it is the reserve currency, and it doesn’t have to pay anything for that. Other countries’ dollars or the other countries’ currency gets deflated. And in fact, the latest theory, which is by a woman called Stephanie Keating, who is Bernie Sanders theoretician says “print as much money as you want–don’t worry about it.” That means you are basically saying, you want to promote US imperialism. Because the only way the United States could print as much money as it wants is as long as it’s a war mongering country, right? Because without the war machine, the United States doesn’t have any access to its reserve currents. But ultimately, what it’s doing to the American public, is… the goal is to move citizens…ultimately, this is going to force the Fed to move everyone to digital currency because what’s going to happen is, today,the USA has 35 trillion dollars, you know, in debt. You take 4% of that, right?, which is going to be about 1.5 trillion dollars or 1.8 trillion, that is 25% of the entire US budget. Now when that hits 60 trillion dollars or 70 trillion, my theory is that the Fed is basically to go to all these banks and say “You know what? We can’t pay you. Here’s digital currency. They’re just going to make up money. And then all these people that they put on welfare and whose economies they’ve destroyed, they are just gonna give people money, which is gonna be digital currency. That digital currency will be on the iPhone which will be completely controlled and it’ll be, you know, centralized so you’ll have this triangle of centralized digital currency with control on this, and they’re going to merge in carbon credits. A small company, the United States was funded two billion dollars to create the exchange for digital currency and carbon tax, and no one’s talking about this. I was the first one to expose this. So as technologies, you can see the merger of the government back toward censorship infrastructure with digital currency with carbon tax. Now if you look at any of these other candidates all of them support one or all of those.

PIERO: Yeah?

SHIVA: Yeah.

PIERO: The fifth question is pretty long. You were running for the position of CEO of Twitter, but Elon Musk nominated Linda Yaccarino instead. I saw that you insulted Musk on Twitter calling him a scumbag; and claimed that he, Tucker Carlson, Donald Trump and Robert F. Kennedy Jr are all Deep State pricks. Even though, for example, Robert F.Kennedy Jr sharedthe same position as you regarding the pandemic and was very active in fighting the lies of Fauci and the global establishment in the biggest scam of the century, moreover, you also claimed that people like Gandhi and Martin Luther King were created as false gods to stop independent movements of the people… The question is, in short, Dr.Shiva, no one is exempt?

SHIVA: No! So let’s talk about this, this question is probably the most important question. My entire life history, as an engineer, as a scientist, has been to understand how you achieve human liberation. This is a very fundamental question

PIERO: I know

SHIVA: and throughout the history of human beings there was a time when people thought we could never have light, there is a time when people thought we could never fly, right? Am I right or wrong, right? 

PIERO: right!

SHIVA: but it was the development and the understanding of Engineering systems principles, Bernoulli’s principles, for example, which allowed us to achieve light or if you think about Newton’s equations which allowed us to build structures like this, right? Over and over again. When it comes to human liberation–liberating people, for good, truly ending exploitation of man by man–the thesis in many people’s brains that have been brainwashed repeatedly: “Is, well, human beings by nature are bad. You know you cannot have a just society. Just move along, right? or “You have to accept scumbags like Robert F Kennedy Jr.” or so on (and we’ll get to this.)

When you study system science there is a science deliberating people, and it is the same science that is involved in understanding engineering principles. You see, we live in a world of systems. When Marx wrote Das Capital or Adam Smith wrote The Wealth of Nations, they didn’t have access to engineering systems principles because these principles weren’t around. So they made some hypotheses. Some of the observations that Marx made were right on target. In particular, is the aspect of how the forces of production affect human consciousness. When you go to Lenin, Lenin advanced that in certain realms, and he got other things wrong. So the Bolsevek revolution, in its early part, was very successful for about two years I’d argue, okay? So these people, these theoreticians have been trying to figure out… and you can’t blame them…(Typically the Western elite intellectuals blame them all–they personalize it.) but I’ve studied this from an engineering standpoint. I’ve studied all great revolutionaries and the conclusion is that it was only in the early 1950s that the science of systems really came to be with the work of Ilya Prigogine, who won the Nobel Prize in medicine. [He says medicine but he won the nobel Prize in chemistry 1977.] So as an engineering systems person, I have been fascinated by how change occurs, be it the thermodynamic system, small systems, large systems, biological systems. And it was during my Fullbright work that I was able to realize that there are nine principles and engineering systems principles and that in fact those same principles match, one to one, with ancient systems of medicine. So when you step back, every system in the universe can be seen as a system composed to these nine principles. Those nine principles, one of those important principles of intelligence systems, is that every intelligence system has a goal. And in the pursuit of that goal (I don’t have time to go into all the details of this today), but, we teach people to start movement, that one of the things that comes in the wave, achieving the goal is a disturbance. That disturbance in your life is like if you want to lose weight, it could be that you have friends who say “eat pizza, drink beer all day.” You have to figure out how to focus your efforts, right? Or, if you’re trying to do anything in life. You know, an airplane is flying, it has different disturbances.

In political systems there are such disturbances. The goal, in my view, is Truth, Freedom and Health. Now, Truth, Freedom and Health, when you analyze this these three words, are not simple Words. “Freedom,” what is freedom? Freedom is the ultimate movement of information, matter, and energy. That principle has existed in ancient systems and medicine and was called “vata.” In the engineering principles it’s called “transport.” Then you look at another principle. So freedom is essential to existence; and another concept is called the conversion principle. Your body takes food and digest and it converts it. In the Indian system that was called “pitta;” in this world “truth” is a refinement process that comes out of practicing the scientific method. You have all sorts of ideas and you practice a scientific method then you get to the truth. But you can’t get to truth if you don’t have freedom, right? Because with that open discourse you can never achieve great science. What is “health?” Health is the vessel which contains all. If you’re not healthy, you cannot fight for freedom; you cannot fight for truth. The same principle exists in the engineering principles: it is called “storage” or “structure” which contains transport and conversion that is called “kapha” in the Indian system. So, very simply, I figured out these fundamental principles. Now when you apply to political science and political history you find out something quite compelling.

Over the last thousands of years, like we saw in Rome and places like here, thousands of years ago, those in power, when they saw “bottom up” movements coming, they just destroyed them, right? Forcibly, fascism, just hammered them, but over the last 200 years, the establishment has become far more clever. They have created a different way of disturbing those people that want to be on the track for truth, freedom and health. Whenever they see a “bottom up” movement coming up (and nowadays they can see this in microseconds with social media, people like Peter Thiel or Elon Musk technologies,) which know the overall sentiment of the people. And with that understanding, the establishment started creating the not-so-obvious establishment. This is an engineering force. In India there was a “bottoms up” movement–and you should study the works of Ramakrishna Mukherjee, you know, wrote The Rise and Fall of East India Company or many of the great theoreticians–you’ll find out in 1920s, the Indian people wanted a good Revolution, potentially a violent one. It’s up to them to do what… the American Revolution was about. And that Mercantile Revolution was building, and Gandhi was parachuted in. I mean, this guy is a racist. Go look at his history. He wasn’t fighting for the poor Hindus and the poor black in South Africa. He was fighting for the wealthy merchants in the Transvaal region; and at the time, Gandhi was coming in. So if you really go into it there was a fervent revolutionary movement; and what the British and Gandhi colluded was to create the Indian National Congress. They didn’t want people building a “bottoms up” movement. So for all these brown people, they create a little Congress. They said, “Okay, you guys go in here and argue it out.” It was a safety valve; and Gandhi was allowed to trapes all around India and promote a ridiculous philosophy–that it is good to get… to be beaten up. And it was made into some form… as though people enjoyed being beaten…this is something spiritual. When in reality it was what he actually served doing in India was to ensure that a transfer of power took place. The British actually wanted to leave India. They were ready to leave and transfer power to the Indian elites. In fact, five billion dollars of and more investment occurred after the British left Gandhi’s role was to support that transfer of power. So he appointed Nehru who was sleeping with Mountbatten’s wife, okay? These people are all part of the same thing– so white men with crowns leave India and brown men with white hats take over. India never really got rid of the caste system. Gandhi was frankly a casteist. So one must understand that I have a very different perspective on this, and it’s a great disillusion of Gandhi as some great hero, he wasn’t. He was brought in as a vehicle to make sure this emerging “bottoms up” movement didn’t take place…

PIERO: …even if Gandhi and Martin Luther King were killed, they are not heros in your opinion?

SHIVA: No, they were martyrs that were created by this system, ok? They’re part of what’s called an epiphenomenon. We have to go back and look at what they actually did at the end of the day. Let’s talk about Martin Luther King. If you look at the works of Malcom X… and you see, it’s unfortunate but white liberals for far too long controlled a discourse on change and it’s important that we break through that because there is a bias there. Malcolm X came “bottoms up” which is very different from the southern Baptist bourgeois preacher which Martin Luther King was.

When the Civil Rights Movement was taking place, one of the key solutions was infrastructure in the inner cities– infrastructure, infrastructure, infrastructure. You know their own economic zones. Martin Luther King, again, was brought into this movement. Malcolm X called the march on Washington a circus. If you go look at Robert Kennedy Jr, I mean we’ll get to the Kennedys I mean the Kennedy’s are one of (you can read the work of Seymour Hersch) one of the totally mythologized people. These people were complete mafia and Robert Kennedy F Kennedy senior of Robert Kennedy Jr… I mean, he was bugging all of these civil rights leaders, the entire Southern National Christian Conference and Martin Luther King were promoted. You see, the establishment is very clever again.

PIERO: Smart.

SHIVA: They’re very smart. So they create and promote the not-so-obvious establishment. And my intention is to expose this because this is a force that is a reason that human advancement has not taken place. Not the obvious establishment. Not the Faucis but the not-so-obvious establishment. Faucis is easy to point out.

PIERO: Yes, its older history.

SHIVA: Right. But this phenomenon is… we need to understand this.

PIERO: Yeah.

SHIVA: And to me, the litmus test of someone who really gets both, is for change… I supported Donald Trump, you know, it’s not like I discounted him. I him gave them money. I put up more signs out than most people were Trump supporters, out in the cold, all right.

Michelle and I’ve met with him. We support him but you have to objectively look at what he did. He printed 6.2 trillion dollars. His former wife, Marla Maples, you know, I was the first one to attack Fauci (and we’ll get to Robert Kennedy. Robert Kennedy was supporting lockdowns go look at his tweet of 2020.)

PIERO: Yeah, I know.

SHIVA: Okay, he waited until October 2021 to write a book (most of what is plagiarized for my work). Robert Kennedy is the not-so-obvious establishment… in fact the entire Kennedy’s clan is an institutionalized not-so-obvious establishment and this is the brainwashing that our movement is going to break people from.

Elon Musk…I was the first one to call out.and I took a lot of heat. you know when I put out that tweet–the reason I put out that tweet was a test–hey I’ve been fighting for free speech all my life. There’s a picture of me with 40,000 people trying to kill (Michelle was on the stage with me and John Medlar) 40 of us because they thought we were nazis. So I know what fighting for free speech is. Elon Musk doesn’t. This guy grew up in apartheid South Africa.

PIERO: I know.

SHIVA: So we have to break this brainwashing because the establishment is very clever. Right now they’re creating a neo-establishment. Tucker Carlson, grifters, Robert Kennedy, Trump–it’s all WWE Theater. No different than what used to take place at the Colosseum thousands of years ago. But the good news is our movement exists. And they’re not going to get rid of me. Because I figured them out, and we have a broad leadership that we’re creating. But the key goal is to remove people from this brainwashing. That no change is ever going to come from above; it’s going to come from “bottom up,” period.

PIERO: What do you think of the relationship of Elon Musk and the AI? Sometimes he spoke about, he is very favorable about AI and the next day he says – it can be dangerous.

SHIVA: Here is a thing we need to understand: those in power have (it is a very important question you’re asking) become so facile, at speaking with both sides of the mouth. I mean it’s just, they do it because at the end of the day they hate everyday human beings. They actually, you know, when I used to be in Hollywood, you know, I used to be married to someone out there, right? When someone came for an autograph and left, you know what that person would say? “Oh, that’s that star fucker!” And if you go to Nobu, this one restaurant in Malibu, they all hang out together and they despise everyday people.PIERO: Yeah, we lived there. We met a lot of stars.

SHIVA: Right. But these people are mostly idiots, uneducated people who have golden handcuffs with prostitutes. So now having seen both sides, I can call them out and they need to be called out with viciousness and harshness. And we do that– I believe, you should use the right curse word for the right person at the right time. Now why is that important?

Because people have been brainwashed to give people this respect. So I do it in a very important strategic way, I’m willing to take the hit on it because it has to be done to break people from this magical hypnotic, as though these people are some false, stoic…

PIERO: Stoic.

SHIVA: Yes, stoic people. So when I called Elon Musk a scumbag these words are to break people. Like he’s some genius.

PIERO: What is he saying?

SHIVA: He’s a government frontman.

PIERO: He is the richest man in the world.

SHIVA: Maybe. Maybe, not. He’s an agent of the government. Everything he does comes at the behest of government, period. And you know the interesting with AI, (and I did 20 years of research in AI) the second life (separate from when I made an email as a kid) the second life I had with email was that I was a guy who won the contest to automatically analyze and route email for the White House. I created a company for customer service and for 20 years I did some very groundbreaking work. And all the AI algorithms are pretty similar. But at the end of the day, what you recognize is artificial intelligence could be used for good, but not in the hands of these people. These people want to eliminate human beings and replace human beings, right? (With logos here. But, yeah, but, I don’t, you know) It’s a replacement beings with… it’s ultimately replace human beings, with, replace human beings…

PIERO: with machines…

SHIVA: or if not machines if they can enslave people they’re going to make a decision is it easier to have a bunch of carbon-based beings that they can reuse and kill quickly or do they need silicon-based beings, you see?But the end of the day, artificial intelligence began when Henry Ford created the assembly line, carbon-based beings were repeatedly told to do a task, and now, with modern, you know, algorithms and machine learning stuff you can do this much faster and cheaper.

PIERO: Let’s go to the last two questions. In your recent public speech in Sardinia, you said that the task of the life must be to defeat evil…

SHIVA: Fight evil.

PIERO: Fight or defeat. And this can only be done if people come together independently from below, but you propose to work from above? How do you reconcile the two?

SHIVA: Well, l, no, I don’t propose to work from above.

PIERO: If you go– if you run for president…

SHIVA: Well let’s talk about that, right? You… if you win, right? And you win as an Independent movement that is very, very different than winning with… from above you say now this is

PIERO: Yes and no.

SHIVA: This would be revolutionary actually, right? Now one of the commitments that you have to do AND you have to pay homage to, is you have to keep a decentralized “bottomsup” movement constantly going, right? So, it has to be – the ends and the means cannot be separated. The typical electoral process is: “Oh let me get into office. I’m not gonna say much. AFTER I get it, I’ll do something!”

Because people have been brainwashed to think the ends justify the means, right? So if you look at how we’re running our campaign, we have six very important things on health care, environment, education, innovation etc. All these things, as we’re running, every once every Thursday, we’re actually teaching people how to achieve that now, not after I’m elected. In a decentralized way– does that make sense? 

PIERO: yeah!

SHIVA: So every one of our platforms is something, a living, breathing thing, that encourages people to get involved “bottoms up” that’s just quite innovative, right? it’s saying that…

PIERO: If it works.

Shiva: Well the reality is… the running for office (and what we’re doing already, since 2020) we’ve already galvanized the movement. So the issue is what is governance anyway? What is the purpose of a president? What is the president? A president is supposed to be a spokesperson, right? He’s supposed to be a reflection of the mass consciousness, in my view, that’s …

PIERO: Or a puppet.

SHIVA: Or a puppet. right? Or a puppet. So the movement here is where the ends and the means are constantly united– every microsecond– we’re not saying and we’re doing something else…

It gives us a very interesting opportunity for everyday people to get involved because one of the things we’re teaching people is governance. How you have to raise your consciousness, understand the principles of the system. Learn, teach and serve so our entire program is as our campaign’s growing, we’re going to be having more leaders. Those leaders can be encouraged to educate other people, and raise their consciousness in this very, very important approach. So we win regardless of whether we actually win the presidential election because we would have raised people’s consciousness. To start recognizing that the not-so-obvious establishment is a real enemy which is a huge learning. Think about that. How many people in India?… I mean a lot of the young people know about Gandhi.

How many African-Americans know that Martin Luther King was really not their hero, right? How many people know that Elon Musk is a scumbag, right?

As we do this, think about what’s going to happen? People are going to say, “now wait a minute, Dr.Shiva has always… Everything he predicted in 2020 is coming. How did he do that? Oh, he understands this very important set of principles!

I can learn how to do that!

And I think if you look at the United States right now, if people want to live longer, they have to support our movement and vote for me. If they want to die younger, they should vote for any one of the other candidates. It’s that simple.

PIERO: Somehow, you could say, that fighting evil is fighting ignorance.

SHIVA: It is, and one of the … if you look at my namesake “Shiva” he has his trishula and pierces darkness and destroying ignorance is what it’s actually about. And I think…

PIERO: The creator and the destructor. SHIVA: destroyer…

SHIVA: But destruction of ignorance is what, to me, that’s what evil really is. It’s ignorance. So by doing this, we’re going to win anyway, because think about how many people, I mean, whenever I travel now, random people come running to me in an airport. Random people– a housewife in Dubai comes running and says, “I saw your video and I know they stole thatelection. And I understand this– thank you for your videos!” I get random phone calls from people– “thank you very much I was about to be admitted to the ICU. I took your vitamin D3.” You know, so we know we’ve already saved and helped a lot of people. So now this movement grows. Our goal is to have leaders who actually get this and they become teachers and educators. So we see nothing but the option to win everywhere we go, and it’s only a matter of time how many people’s consciousness we raise. Think about how many nuclear physicists there are (maybe a thousand) how many people not to build a nuclear bomb, BUT one person knows how to build a nuclear bomb is a billion times more powerful than people who are just cutting wood and burning fire, right? So our goal is to teach people these principles so that they don’t get fooled again.

PIERO: Your story could have the title “From Untouchable Indian to American Prophet” since you claim you have a 100% prediction capacity. On what do you base this certainty, and who, then, do you predict will be the next American president?

SHIVA: Well, the certainty that I have comes from a couple of important dimensions. When you apply these systems principles you start seeing a recurring pattern, and you can see things. So the reason I’m able to call out Elon Musk; the reason I’m able to call out Donald Trump or all of these characters, particularly, the, what I call the “entertainment characters”– Joe Rogan– all these people. Because when you look at it from a system standpoint, you see their interconnections. If you just see them alone as individuals, it’s easy to get fooled, but when you see their interconnections, the fact that Joe Rogan is represented by William Morris Agency endeavor, right? The fact that Ari Emanuel was the agent for Donald Trump AND ALSO the agent for Joe Rogan, you start realizing these people are a swarm of birds, right? It’s not like the problem some of these conspiracy theorists have where they try to say the center of power is this individual. They get it wrong. It’s more that they’re a collective swarm. They too are decentralized, so once you understand these principles, it’s pretty easy to see the stuff.

It’s really not that difficult concerning who’s gonna win the president, right? I can tell you this, that the trajectory right now, is it doesn’t matter whether the left or right win. Their goal is to have somebody in the left or right win, and someone from the left or right will win.

However, what you what they do not understand, is that when you actually look at system science or something quite powerful. Since the time of Newton the world became very, very, mechanistic. What did Newton actually discover, he discovered these laws of motion. Now the day that Newton figured out those laws of motions, the same day people didnt say, “Oh my god, the universe can be so predictable.” It’s too much mechanized. So at the same time religion came, because they said, “No there’s a God!” you know. If the world is so mechanized, it doesn’t make sense. So we have this thing with religion and science, right? starting to come. The problem is that the mechanistic view of the Universe leads to a point where you think it’s just the way it’s gonna be, right? Because, that’s because, if you can predict the motion of all planets, where that leads to, is this is where the amount of data collection that’s going on, to surveillance, is on this theory that if I collect enough data on you and you I can predict exactly what you’re gonna buy, do, etc. But the reality is that when you study system science it turns out that the universe is not mechanistic, that Einstein and Newton actually are an approximation of reality. The truth is that universe is actually in chaos and sometimes it creates mechanistic conditions which is what we have. And this is what the work of Ilia Prigogine was, okay? So it turns out that in one single individual thought consciousness, can change the world. And this is very important it’s called a small fluctuation, okay? Thought form. I mean when you look at the works of…

PIERO: Freedom of thought.

SHIVA: Yes, but in the reality is a universe that is actually chaotic and under certain times it becomes mechanistic. That is the fact. Because I can get into the more details on this and this is been something very very interesting since the second law of thermodynamics that came to be, there was this contradiction in science because between the mechanistic view of time and the irreversible view of time or the reversible view of time–irreversible view– forPrigogine’s work, essentially, bridged this gap. And what it really shows is that out of chaos order comes to be. So the natural state of all things is actually in a quite an uncertain state that things are not predetermined and anything is actually possible and small fluctuations can create very big changes.

PIERO: But this is only from a materialistic point of view what about spirit… 

SHIVA: No no no it isn’t, this… What’s really cool about this approach is that it merges heaven and earth. It actually intersects this false dichotomy between science and religion.


SHIVA: And that’s what’s so powerful about this. The science of systems actually bridges heaven and earth. Think about what I just shared here. If you look at the ancient rishi’s. when they looked at the body, they didn’t see it as molecules or genes. They created what I shared with you. If you look at… there’s a paper I wrote out of my Fullbright work which literally shows that the systems of yoga and the systems and the systems of medicine were together. But what I’ve shown, which no one else has done before, is that the principles of that match, one to one, with modern engineering systems principles. And the cool thing is I can teach Ayurveda to someone within 30 minutes.

Seriously. What happened was the Indian system of medicine yoga became again this top-down Guru worship. Guys got bebudi. He’s got a robe. He’s got a beard. And you have to bow down to him. And I’ve democratized that, through the work we’ve done, with your body, your system. So my entire purpose is that many of these systems of knowledge can be made accessible to everyday human beings. You know, today about 20,000 people know the knowledge of systems. George Soros is a theoretician in it. I used to teach it at MIT. I could have just gone back route but like Prometheus who brought fire to the earth, what we’ve done is with signs of system, we…if you go to our website truthfreedomahealth for develop you’ll see there’s everyday people, electricians, plumbers we are teaching. They’re getting as much as the same knowledge as an MIT PhD. And with that knowledge, they’re going to be… and when we have enough people with that knowledge it’s going to be game-set- match!

That’s why I’m confident about this. Because it’s ultimately about raising consciousness.

PIERO: This is the ultimate goal.

SHIVA: It’s the ultimate goal. It’s the only goal. And the only mission in life is to fight evil. 

PIERO: Yeah.

SHIVA: Regardless of where it takes you, because there is no other mission.

PIERO: Every life.

SHIVA: Every life whether you lose or you win you have to fight evil. yeah even if you have a small victory you have to continue.

PIERO: Everybody in his place 

SHIVA: Exactly!

 PIERO: We don’t sit in the Oval Office or in Kremlin we sit here and this is our duty. So Dr.Shiva, thank you for your time. It really was a pleasure.

SHIVA: Great questions!

* * *


In reference to some requests for clarification on the issue of ineligibility of foreign-born individuals, Dr.Shiva kindly sent me this note:

Article 2 Section 1 of the Constitution referred to “native born” requirement for being President. However, “native born” was never defined. In fact the Maryland Legislature voted to make Marquis De Lafayette and his family native born US Citizens.

Regardless, the Constitution is not a fixed document. It changes with things called Amendments. The 5th and 14th Amendments combined with many Supreme Court rulings made it explicitly clear that it is UNCONSTITUTIONAL to discriminate between a Native Born and Naturalized Citizen.

Therefore, it is Unconstitutional to NOT allow me to run and moreover to become President. This would violate those two Amendments, which abrogated/repealed Article 2 Section 1.

Finally, in 2011, the FEDERAL ELECTION COMMISSION (FEC) ruled in the Hassan case that though he was a Naturalized citizen, he could run for President and raise monies privately but just could not receive matching funds.

This is clear as day, I can run abs be President.

If any of the States challenge me, we will take this all the way to the Supreme Court.


Special thanks to Paola Tedde and Gwyn Schmidtberger for transcribing the interview

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